Avogadro 2 Discoverability

General Discussion
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A primary issue facing Avogadro 2 is the ease of access for new users. Things like the now-fixed python bug that stopped Avo2 from alerting users when they didn’t have python installed or the issues with force-fields defaulting to the LJ potential with ions and radicals (causing significant molecular spaghetti) generally present a significant barrier for users who want a “plug-and-play” experience. I myself encountered many of these issues when I first started using Avo2 almost 2 years ago, but I was persistent since many alternatives, in the words of another computational chemist, "feel like 2006 Java slop.”

Recently, with how well Avogadro 2 has been progressing in terms of overall stability, features, and general ease of use, I’ve been suggesting it to anyone who is looking for visualization software (and anyone who even so much as expresses mild interest in looking at molecules). I’ve also polled some small parts of the computational chemistry community to see why it isn’t the default program for most use, as it seems to me like it is better than 99% of software out there for visualization.

From my questioning, it turns out that the issue isn’t bugs or crashes, it’s that when you google “Avogadro 2” the first link is https://www.openchemistry.org/projects/avogadro2/, which directs visitors to a download page that has Avogadro 1.91.0 as the latest version. That version is 7 years out of date!

On the off chance that a user types in “Avogadro 2 download” the first link is https://two.avogadro.cc/, but the immediate number 2 is the OpenChemistry website and just a few entries down is a link to the SourceForge page that only gives up to Avogadro 1.90.0!

So, in an effort to not raise an issue without also proposing a solution, I have a simple fix (simple to say, not necessarily simple to implement).

First, someone needs to get in touch with the owner/maintainer of the OpenChemistry website (I think it’s Marcus Hanwell) and either get them to update the website or just take it down entirely. I lean more towards taking down the website since it doesn’t seem to be actively maintained by anyone, and the Avogadro 2 website does just fine for hosting the download and user guide. Second, the SourceForge site has to either get updated or get removed, which I think is easier to deal with than the OpenChemistry website since @ghutchis is listed as having access.

I also think there should be more emphasis for users to download the nightly builds on the website instead of the releases, at least for now while 2.0 is still in the works. The nightlies might introduce some bugs, but by and large they fix more bugs than they introduce.

Anyways, that’s what I’ve learned. The primary issues aren’t necessarily bugs and crashes, but just getting the right version in the first place.

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It’s not Marcus. Kitware owns the domain. Marcus had an agreement to transfer control and it never happened. I’m not entirely sure why - TomViz and StemPy are still being developed but are much more electron-microscopy using VTK / ParaView.

I sent a message to Kitware suggesting that the openchemistry.org site move to GitHub hosting. At the least, it doesn’t reflect anything with TomViz and reflects really poorly on them IMHO. Neither MongoChem or Molequeue are updated.(The internal wiki is actually already gone.) I’ll continue to ping them. :man_shrugging:

As far as SourceForge and discovering https://two.avogadro.cc/ - IMHO it’s mostly getting the “new” website in shape to replace https://avogadro.cc.

If we can get the “new” website in better shape, I’d be happy to “move” it to avogadro.cc and add a bunch of redirects.

Anyone able to help edit some docs and provide updated screenshots?

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Heck, if someone can help put together a checklist of website sections to revise, that would be a great way to start.

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So to be clear, you’d like someone to get a list of sections on https://two.avogadro.cc/ to be revised? Or do you want sections from https://avogadro.cc to be revised?

I’ve been getting bogged down with work lately so my work on updating the user guide have been stalled. Since I have a break after this week I can probably crank out more user guide rewrite and I’d also be happy to put together a checklist for revisions.

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I’d love to have a checklist for revisions on https://two.avogadro.cc - ideally a “minimal required” and a “let’s work on over time” list (or similar priority tiers). For example, updating screenshots for all the menus and tools is sorely needed. The “building materials” section can probably go into the “let’s work on over time” category.

Even just helping to take screenshots and putting it on Google Drive or Dropbox is very useful - not just for you, but for anyone reading this. Like take a screenshot or two and upload it here or link to a folder that we can use for the revisions.

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Getting back to this.. One thing that would help for openchemistry.org is if someone has a few minutes to put together a minimal one-page “splash” template to explain OpenChemistry as an overall group to push open source in chemistry (e.g., including icons and links to two.avogadro.cc and tomviz.org)

It might be easier if it uses Jekyll since that’s the default for GitHub pages, but it’s been a while since I’ve looked at themes / web design.

But any simple webpage generator would be great. I think just having a quick splash page would make the transition easier. (I have downloaded a mirror of the current website.)